Graeme Spiers

Two Face · Graeme Spiers

I know Ross can't stomach him but for me, he's the last bastion of truth in the Scottish Media.

Agree with him 100% on his latest article about that wee unpleasant man who is the manager of Celtic.

Cappo · Re: Graeme Spiers

Fionn Makool

I for one have to back Mr Spiers. I think he is an excellent journalist who isnt afraid to be opinionated. Now I am not going to say he is right in everything he talks about but which commentator is?

And I am sure he left the Herald to go to the London Times (Scotland based)

Two Face

He called Lennon a 'wonderful human being' ??

Wooooooft.

I wouldn't even have called him a *HUMAN* being.

Stan

That'll be Ross's cue to find a million and one quotes from him.. but personally I don't mind him that bad.. I don't like his use of big long words when it's totally not needed.. and I can't stand his general persona.. but have nothing against him as a sports journalist.

Two Face

There's no doubt he has a wee fixation with the Queens XI, but see if you get past that, he's a right decent journo.

Cappo

Cappo

Just a few points about Spiers to show why I and many Rangers fans don't like him. This highlights Spiers complete one-sidedness on plenty of issues.

While you may even agree with Spiers on some of the point in his quotes, his ability to compliment Celtic on something he has a go at Rangers for baffles me from someone who's meant to be a neutral journo.

Agenda? Never!

Spiers had started his one-man campaign of anti-Rangers bile long before he joined the Herald. One of my earliest memories was his blatant lie that Rangers fans sang (about German superstar Jurgen) “Klinsmann’s a Klansman” at Ibrox. Complete and utter bollocks. Another contention of his was that former Ranger Ian Ferguson had “all the charm of a child molester”. A pleasant analogy I’m sure you’d agree. I would wager that Spiers would not express his strikingly odd views during a face-to-face meeting with our former midfielder.

In July 1996 whilst with Scotland On Sunday he penned a deplorable attack on the late great Jock Wallace the day after he passed away, the inference being that Wallace was a bully and a bigot and responsible for sectarianism in Scottish football. Spiers twisted insinuations flew completely in the face of former Celtic captain Andy Lynch who said this on hearing of Wallace’s passing “He would always take the time (prior to Old Firm encounters) in the nervy pre-match atmosphere, be it at Parkhead or Ibrox, to come and give me a warm handshake or hug and sincere best wishes……smart, kind and sensitive. He will be sadly missed.”

Lisbon Lion Tommy Gemmell echoed Lynch’s sentiments “It doesn't matter what side of the fence you were on, I don't think you will find anyone in Scottish football who had a bad word to say about him. It was always a pleasure to be in his company and talk to him. His crack was different class.'' Almost correct Tommy. You WILL find someone who has a bad word to say about him. Graham Spiers.

Bad-mouthing deceased Rangers heroes has since become a theme for this creature. He has written disrespectful articles on late greats Bill Struth, Jim Baxter and Davie Cooper. Of course as with Wallace none of them were here to defend themselves. Spiers wrote the following on the eve last seasons’ League Cup Final against Motherwell, a game dedicated to Coop’s memory:

“More remarkable, though, amid the media and marketing frenzy surrounding the game, is the way the memory of Cooper's career has become lodged halfway between legend and myth………..One problem with the Davie Cooper legend is that, as with many public personalities who die young and become subject to mythology, it doesn't wholly square with the facts of his career. For a so-called "genius", you would certainly have expected Cooper, who died at 39, to have won more than his 22 international caps.”

To write the above just hours prior to a game played in tribute to Davie where his family would be in attendance was nothing short of despicable.

On Struth: “Bill Struth was either an idol or an idiot depending on your point of view”. There you are Mr. Murray, according to Speirs you may have unveiled a statue of an idiot at half-time during the Moenchengladbach game.

Now on to you and I, the Rangers support. Commenting on the Manchester United v. Rangers match last year he described us as “A stinking bigoted cesspit of sub-humanity”. Let me remind you that there were NO arrests at the match. A Manchester United publication later described the game as having the best atmosphere of the season due to the visiting Bears. Some other lovely descriptions of you and I from Mr. Spiers:

6/11/03
“Rancid chanting…..total embarrassment……putrid stench…..savages….poisonous singing…..desecration…..cavemen…...wholesale yobishness…..vile troglodytes…..stinking, bigoted, religious stuff……backward culture…..almost to a man”.

29/11/04
“David Murray is on the back foot…..at Rangers, by general consent, the sectarianism is worse than it is at Celtic……It was an experience that reminded me again of how widespread and malignant bigotry at Ibrox is……It is folly, not to say a cultural disservice to Scotland, to denounce O'Neill for what he said this week…..Rangers, in particular, have a major problem with bigots”.

“Compare and contrast their shameful behaviour with that of Celtic, who on the road to Seville last season, represented Scottish football immaculately” (I suppose they did, if you don’t include the stabbing in Seville, the riot in Blackburn, the Provo banners, the booing of Porto as they lifted the trophy, planes being diverted to Cardiff etc. etc. etc. But why let the FACTS get in the way of a dig at Rangers eh Graham?)

I think Spiers has made it very clear how he feels about US the supporters’ ladies and gentleman, but what’s his views on our club?

8/10/02
"Like the Rangers orange strip, the song ('Follow, Follow') cannot be listed among the great criminal acts, it merely offends”

25/4/04
“Nor can I recall Rangers being disparaged in 1972 when they won the Cup-Winners' Cup; a tournament which, by definition, was painfully inferior to the European Cup, indeed a prize which many placed third in the list of Europe's club baubles behind the UEFA Cup.”

12/8/04
“Please can I be spared any whining from Rangers over this and other criticisms?” “(Rangers) the most paranoid club in Scottish football”.

Fair to say he’s none to keen on our club either! But what does he say about our biggest rivals I hear you ask? Surely in the interest of neutrality and parity, Celtic are afforded the same malevolence?

23/8/02
“Celtic, though, as a football institution, quite rightly remains a symbol of Catholicism. The Celtic strip, as famed and proudly known around the world as it is, still cannot be divorced from one of its cultural parents, which is the Catholic faith.”

4/3/04
“Even high-brow Herald readers, hauling their noses away from such works as Jacob Bronowski and Alexander Solzhenitsyn, may have noticed the palaver that is being planned by Celtic supporters in time for Sunday's slaughter - erm, I mean match - against Rangers at Parkhead.”

25/3/04
“I repeat my main contention: that Larsson's contribution to Scottish life and culture, via the game of football, has been immense. In a sordid football age, his role-model status has also been impeccable.” (Deliberately breaking Gus MacPherson’s leg aside presumably).

1/4/04
“Following Sunday's win at Ibrox I met one Celtic player, a man I remain a great admirer of, and whispered to him: "I fear for some of the alcoholic carnage of you lot over the next few days, it's been a long wait." He smiled and looked at me with rivulets of anticipation dribbling from his chops.”

6/5/04, 22/1/04, 27/11/03, 4/4/02, 7/3/02,
“In one of my favourite magazines, The Alternative View….. the shockingly good magazine, The Alternative View……It was with great joy that I received my copy the other day of The Alternative View, a genuinely enjoyable football magazine of a Celtic persuasion…..the excellent Alternative View, a new mag set up by my old malapropic mucker himself, Matt McGlone….. After 36 years of unchallenged success, the Celtic View at last has a commercial rival…..If I tell readers that Matt McGlone is the brains behind this venture, you may well share my intrigue….. a Che Guevara figure among the fans who helped ease Fergus McCann into place….. I have seen the first edition of The Alternative View, and, I must say, it looks very good. (This is just some of a number of plugs he gave for his bigoted mate McGlone’s failed Celtic magazine in the pages of the Herald).

20/5/04
“Lennon's symphony is music to my ears - My sporting highlight of the past week must be the moment when I was called upon to break the news to Neil Lennon that James MacMillan, Scotland's most distinguished composer, had written a piece in his honour. It is always a minor joy catching up with Lennon.” (In fact Graham loves “Lenny” so much he excused him his spitting on a Rangers scarf and mouthing “orange bastards” to the Rangers support. A strange stance for an individual who has propelled himself to the forefront of McConnell’s anti-bigotry campaign wouldn’t you agree?)

“Celtic have a moral right to this league” (on the day before the 2003 title deciders).

“35,000 Celtic fans singing The Fields of Athenry made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up” (Seems Spiers likes the “tottie famine, rebelling against the Crown” ditty. Compare and contrast with his viewpoint of Follow Follow above)

WARNING: Please have a basin handy prior to reading the next quote.

22/01/03
“I must admit, if I ever fulfil my ambition of having a very splendid private dinner with O'Neill, it will be the one question I'll certainly get round to asking: ''Why were you so horrible to us over that new contract saga?''

I’m sure you’ll agree it’s plain as the nose on your face who are Spiers favourite team down Glasgow way.

Last season I attended a Rangers v. Aberdeen match at Ibrox. Meeting up with my good friend North East Bear post match, he told me he’d been sitting directly behind Spiers. After 6 minutes the Aberdeen fans broke into their “Nice One Simmy” routine, rejoicing in the injury inflicted on Ian Durrant by Neil Simpson, which effectively ruined the wee man’s career. North East Bear pointed this out to Spiers. He further pointed out bile coming from the Aberdeen section revelling in the death of 66 people in the Ibrox Disaster and the death of Davie Cooper at both half-time and full time. Spiers in his Monday morning match report PRAISED the Aberdeen fans for singing “Nice one JIMMY” claiming they were showing support for their manager Mr. Calderwood! North East Bear wrote to the Herald editor pointing out Speirs perversion. Needless to say he received no reply. For the record, Darrell King of the Evening Times stated on Real Radio that anyone who claimed they couldn’t hear the word “Simmie” (as opposed to Jimmy) was kidding themselves on. So there you have it. Spiers is prepared to tell LIES to antagonise Rangers fans. A fellow sports journalist and Newsquest employee confirmed that to be the case.

Whilst on the subject of wee Durranty, please note that Spiers once claimed in Scotland on Sunday that Simpson wasn’t the only one to raise his boot in the tackle, of course inferring that Durrant was also looking to inflict injury. Revisionism at it’s very best. Commenting years later on the incident, Spiers claimed “Rangers fans carry this around with them in much the same way as Phil Boersma carried Durrant”. Real classy eh?

Back to more recent times and the Alex Rae incident during a Euro fixture last season. Spiers led the case for the prosecution (ably aided and abetted by Radio Clyde it has to be said), finding Rae guilty on all counts.

“For days, almost inconceivably, Rangers had denied that Rae had done anything wrong.”

”The response of Alex McLeish, the Rangers manager, to Rae's kick had bordered on the inane.”

"While just about every neutral regarded the challenge as despicable, McLeish referred to the criticism of Rae as ‘hysterical’ and had the temerity to claim that Rae's challenge on Dadu was "not premeditated".

"Rangers got caught up in gauche attempts to defend the indefensible"

"McLeish insults everyone's intelligence, not least his own, in presenting such a fatuous defence of his player."

"UEFA, like the rest of the country, have laughed at this preposterous interpretation by Rangers."

"Apparently, for those who know how to access these things, the berserk hotlines and websites of the club's supporters have almost depicted the rest of us as making up this outrage." (Notice the "for those who know how to access these things", the inference being that your average Bear is not intelligent enough to use a PC).

"There remains something risible and worryingly paranoid about Rangers believing that neutrals, the media, and UEFA have got together to have it in for the club."

"Rangers are left lacking respect."

Let’s make one thing clear. Dadu got up and walked away. No lasting damage was inflicted. He played for his club regularly for the rest of the season. James Wesolowski, the 17-year-old Leicester player who was brutally assaulted by Bobo Balde during a recent so-called “friendly” will be lucky to recover and play the beautiful game again. I await Mr. Spiers condemnation of the Celtic thug. It should also be noted that Spiers didn’t bother with a vitriolic attack on his beloved Larsson when he deliberately snapped Gus MacPherson’s leg. Perhaps Celtic players shattering opponents limbs is of no consequence to the little creep.

Onto another point. Speirs gave a lecture on sectarianism at Turnbull Hall, Glasgow University, on behalf of the Newman Association on the17th March 2005. Said lecture was conveniently arranged for the same night as an important Rangers league match. I dare say Spiers wouldn’t want to run the risk that any of us “poisonous stinking bigoted cavemen” would turn up and challenge his lies. An East End of Glasgow Roman Catholic schoolteacher stated the IRA song Boys of the Old Brigade was intellectually superior to any Rangers song and was a cultural representation of Celticness. Speirs refused to challenge the bigot. One dreads to think what kind of poison this crackpot is polluting his pupils’ minds with.

Cappo

And another one from him last week

"It is these slogans, and not the droning Derry’s Walls, which embarrass Rangers FC."
Compare and contrast:

"35,000 Celtic fans singing The Fields of Athenry made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up"

So, Rangers fans "celebrate their culture" with droning songs, Celtic fans celebrate theirs with songs that make the hairs on the back of his neck stand up.

Now we all have our views on Orange / Republican songs and whether they have a place at the games or not (for me Derry's Walls is a much a song to be sung at Ibrox as FOS is at Hampden or TFOA at Parkhead) but for a suposedly intelligent man to decry it while bigging up one of the others it nonsense.

The man's a wind up merchant and not a very good one at that.

Fionn Makool

I have to combat (unfortunate turn of phrase) one thing here Rosco.

“35,000 Celtic fans singing The Fields of Athenry made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up” (Seems Spiers likes the “tottie famine, rebelling against the Crown” ditty. Compare and contrast with his viewpoint of Follow Follow above)

The insinuation that Fields of Athenry has any bigoted sentiment purely on the line "against the crown" is a folly of the highest degree. I am sure given an opportunity to listen to the purity of the song when not sang by a marauding crowd of football fans you would agree on this point.

The point that spiers made on STV's wonderous footie magazine last Monday said it all. It is the add ons to these songs which are offensive, not the songs themselves. In truth he was referring to songs sang by the Rangers support and not the Celtic support, but, and I say this loosely, I believe if you questioned Mr Spiers directly on Celtic fans chanting IRA during the chorus of this song he would agree there is no place for that either. The add ons here are the problem. And, we must be completely honest about this, the singing of ad ons in cutural songs is/was far greater at Ibrox than Parkhead over the last number of years. I wil agree that at away games both sets of numpties are harder to control and therefore more prominent.[/quote]

Cappo

I'm not decrying the FOA at all (the comments you quoted were from another author - not my words). The Rangers actually sing a song to the same tune with slightly different words. I've no problem with either song.

What gets me about Spiers is that even when he makes a fair point about the add ons (and I do agree they must be stopped by both sets of fans) is that as he's realised there is absolutely no argument to be had about Derry's Walls he still manages to get a dig in about it being a drone when almost coming in his pants about the FOA.

To say that one set of 50,000 Glaswegians singing in a football ground are more tuneful than another set is just embarrasing.

Follow Follow has no room for question in any sectarian discussion yet he manages to tell us that it "offends"

He's not an impartial writer.

You wouldn't see him dare to comment on Jimmy Johnstone the way he did about Cooper or about Stein in the way he did about Jock Wallace or Bill Struth.

"Combat" indeed ya bas :mrgreen:

Fionn Makool

But Celtic fans are better singers than Rangers fans, thats a known fact. Rod Stewart? Celtic fan! Oasis knobends? Celtic fans! Michelle McManus? Celtic fan! (I actually have no idea who she supports if anyone but she has the same surname as the Celtic captain so the law of probability would suggest so).

So, by that careful and protracted reasoning, Mr spiers is probably right! C'mon Rosco. Thats the strongest argument yet.

Bob

I was surprised to see Spiers say this about the add ons last week so much so that I almost took it to be a bit of a bold statement on his part.

I've lost count of the amount of times spiers (and his ilk) have been challenged on what exactly was deemed offensive and countless times over the last year and a bit, they've always avoided getting into details about it. David Edgar from the Rangers Supporters Trust asked him repeatedly on Real Radio several months ago what he had a problem with and was accused of prevaricating (or some other thesaurus found wanky-terminology that he likes to use) on the issue, when in fact he was just taking the conversation into uncomfortable, but important territory that Spiers has only now seen fit to respond to and to deem relevant.

On reflection I now realise that there must be a broad understanding of what will and what will not be tolerated, what with the season having already kicked off and the new SPL directives actively in place. He just happens to have been the first person I heard to say it, and he did a good job of trying to pass it off as his own long term strongly held belief.

He contributes feck all in my opinion, although there's hope for him yet. If I keep listening to or reading what he has to say, I might yet have a chance of beating the bird at scrabble (she's dead good at it so she is).

Fionn Makool

Fionn Makool

And heres one I learned last night. Everyone who has been taking part in this blog could be termed as an interlocutor. Our interlocution has been interlocutory.

That should impress her Bob!

Cappo

Quite what the master of ceremonies at a black and white minstrel show has to do with this thread I don't know. :smt002

Stan

Two Face

Another bang on piece about the Modern Day Football fans.

Fucking Arseholes to a man who should not be allowed anywhere near a football stadium.

Ross has brought this up before as well.

When fans are on receiving end, they’re so quick to go blubbing

Graham Spiers

I have to be honest, I savoured the sight of Gordon Strachan and Garry Pendrey jointly giving what for to that jumped-up marshal in the main stand during those final moments of mayhem at Pittodrie on Sunday.

What was the bloke in the stand thinking of? OK, managers and coaches should desist from making any sort of gesture to the crowd, but what kind of mindset causes a marshal in a football stand to rush down a staircase and start jabbing his finger at a dugout? You would almost think the bloke at Pittodrie had a pathological hatred of Strachan or Celtic.

Is it just me, or isn’t there something absolutely delicious about a coach or manager being allowed to give back to a crowd what crowds have traditionally seen as their divine right to dish out?

I have always found it hilarious the way many football fans are big enough and hearty enough to dole out terrible stick, but then suddenly turn into a bunch of wounded ballet critics the moment that venom is turned back on themselves.

I have always secretly admired managers who are prepared to take on a crowd at their own game. Some years back I remember Dick Advocaat at Ibrox rounding on a group of Rangers fans in the Ibrox enclosure, who had been giving Sergio Porrini some fearful stick, and giving them a dose of their own medicine. As only Wee Dick could — chest puffed out, forearms pumping in true Mussolini style — he gave that enclosure what for. The fans looked a mite taken aback when Advocaat in turn laid into them.

On another vivid occasion, this time at Fir Park, I remember Alex McLeish getting into an altercation with some Motherwell fans over the stick they were doling out to Andy Roddie, a particularly ill-fated Motherwell winger of the time.

Some of you may be familiar with that main stand at Fir Park: it can sometimes match the lost civilisation once known as Broomfield Park, Airdrie, for sheer undiluted venom. More pertinently, there are a bunch of seats right behind the home dugout that make for the perfect spot to hurl abuse and contempt at any home player whom you feel is letting the cause down.

That day at Fir Park, poor Roddie was being mercilessly hounded.

For his part, McLeish in particular felt it, because he had signed Roddie from Aberdeen, and not for peanuts, but for £100,000 (try that at Motherwell these days). All of a sudden McLeish rounded on the main stand and, jabbing his finger at one group of fans, started shouting: “Gie him a break! Just youse gie him a break!”

The moral never seems to change: fans can wade in among players, coaches and managers with any degree of verbal savagery but, as Tommy Burns said yesterday, the moment a coach or a player responds in type, the supporters go blubbing to the police.

The finest example I believe I’ve seen of this was an hilarious episode at Ibrox nearly four years ago, when Neil Lennon, then the Celtic captain, was receiving dog’s abuse from thousands of Rangers fans, not a lot of it unrelated to his ethnic or denominational background.

Lennon, as he does, withstood the barrage of abuse almost in semi-enjoyment, before having the temerity then to shout something equally unsavoury back as he disappeared down the Ibrox tunnel at the end of the game.

My goodness . . . the hurt, the deep hurt, caused by Lennon’s comment among his accusers! A group of Rangers fans went off and called in a lip-reader to prove that Lennon had been rude to them. As Lennon quipped later: “I certainly didn’t need a lip-reader to work out what 30,000 of them were shouting at me . . .”

The best story told about the ludicrous grievances of fans was related by Tony Higgins, these days a trade union official on behalf of Europe’s professional footballers, but back in the glory days a 15st slacker who led Partick Thistle’s attack to repeated near-glory.

Higgins was walking off the Firhill pitch a beaten man for the umpteenth time when a Thistle diehard began savaging him, with plenty uses of the F-word and the C-word, over his woeful play.

The rant having lasted a good while, Higgins responded with something akin to: “Right, that’s it, I’m going to report you to the psychiatric unit of Strathclyde’s new mental health division, and specifically ask that they monitor your behaviour for a period of 12 months . . .” If only.

Quite a few people in football need to get their heads in order — and they are not always the blokes down in the technical areas.

Fionn Makool

Hang on! Did he just praise two former Rangers managers aswel as the current Celtic one?

Cappo

You know at the start of that article, I just knew he'd manage to get a wee dig in about Rangers fans and slabber over that (his words) "wonder human being" poor wee Neil.

Rather than praising Adcovaat who has no ties to Rangers now, it's a chance for him to dig at the Rangers fans again.

Rangers fans can quite clearly be heard chanting "Lennon Lennon get to fuck" during the incident Spiers talks of. There may have been indivdual comments worse than that but the tape of the game and general sound, which is what both Lennon and Spiers would really have heard in the din of Rangers v Celtic game at Ibrox, show absolutely nothing worse than the usual comments from fans and Lennon himself went into the sort of tirade that he was only to happy to run to the media every couple of weeks greeting that he'd been abused in the street.

"Fucking shite you Orange bastards. You're cheats, you're fucking cheats" after he'd halfed a Rangers player. Hardly the innocence Spiers indicates of Lennon in his story.

Plus Lennon's finger pointing during his racist and sectarian outburst was actually to the Rangers bench, not the fans, so his rant wasn't actually in reply to the Rangers fans.

Lennon, as he does, withstood the barrage of abuse almost in semi-enjoyment, before having the temerity then to shout something equally unsavoury back as he disappeared down the Ibrox tunnel at the end of the game.

Eqaully unsavoury? Possibly.

Dissapeared down the tunnel? I think not Graham. The incident happened after 77 minutes of the game. Making it up if he can't remember again is he?

PS. was poor wee Neil helping the sectarian issue at all having later repeated the comments with "Dirty Orange Bastards? shouted at the Rangers fans while spitting on a Rangers scarf?

The snidy comment from Speirs that Rangers fans called in the lip-reader was directly in relation to the Daily Records refusal to do so given Lennon's sectarian comments when they'd hounded Amoruso for calling Borrusia Dortmund player Ikpeba a "black bastard"

Quite possibly the right thing for the record to do in the Amoruso case but why the refusal for them to do the same in a situation related to "Scotland's Secret Shame" ?

Parity is all we ask for.

Spiers has, as shown in the article posted earlier, never shown this to Rangers fans. We'll see when a Rangers player mouths to the Celtic side of things what Spiers has to say about it all. He's never been one for checking his facts and has tripped himself up many's a time with contrasting views on subjects when it suits him. He's not a very clever person for one who uses such big words.

I agree with Stevie's thoughts on the general reactions of some fans. My problem, in the instance Spiers uses to have a go at Rangers fans with Lennon comes when a Rangers fan is arrested for shouting "Fenian Bastard" but a Celtic player can get away with " Orange Bastards"

Parity again Graham....

It crosses this arguement and the madness of the rulings the SPL are trying to invoke about "offensive chanting" but it's a fair point none the less.

Surprisngly, Spiers has never covered this issue.

Two Face

To be honest, we all know my feelings on Neil Lennon and his general wankbagness.

See, since I've been off I've been doing a lot of reading and I've purchased a few rags daily to keep me gawn and they're full of absolute drivel.

It's frightening.

You have your issues with Spiers Rossco, but see thon Keith Jackson.

FUCK ME.

A stuck up, loathesome scumbag of the first magnitude.

How he gets away with his articles I'll never know.

Cappo

I've got my issues with suppose Rangers fan Jackson too.

His lies over the cancelled game in Bolton should have seen him removed from his post immediately.

You're be better spending your 20p for these rags on comdoms with holes in them. They're about as much use or fun .

Cappo

I've got my issues with suppose Rangers fan Jackson too.

His lies over the cancelled game in Bolton should have seen him removed from his post immediately.

You're be better spending your 20p for these rags on comdoms with holes in them. They're about as much use or fun .

Graeme Spiers

Re: Graeme Spiers